Demand for answers over ocean death
Submitted by hezzy on Mon, 2014-11-03 14:25
makes you wonder how proffesional some of these operations are &how this could happen
https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/25411022/demand-for-answers-over-ocean-death/
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OFW 11
evil flourishes when good men do nothing
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Shouldnt be happening since
Shouldnt be happening since those divers over east, but then 30 blokes who may be half cut are pretty hard to organise.
Even if you head count them as they leave and come up one short, half will have trotted off before you realise one is missing.
Then you wont know who it is or a miscount.
Having said that, it will be the masters responsibilty.
I would hate to be doing those sort of charters, especially bucks etc
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
clogwog
Posts: 265
Date Joined: 01/02/11
Absolute tragedy, the bloke
Absolute tragedy, the bloke who lost his life was my mortgage broker, I spent an hour with him last week finalizing documentation and discussing our local area, it was the first time my wife had met him and she commented on how nice a guy he was and how well he did his job.
I actually spoke to his Personal assistant on Friday and she mentioned that he was out on a work function, from what I am led to believe it was a function with other Loan Market franchisees etc.
Clearly no one is sure what has happened, at the end of the day this fella has a wife and three young children he has left behind and I can understand that his wife is upset.
RIP Damien Mills
uncle
Posts: 9354
Date Joined: 10/02/07
a real tragedy
a fun day out gone really bad,condolences to the family
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
Dale
Posts: 7930
Date Joined: 13/09/05
Yeah, RIP, It was bloody poor form by the charter mob concerned, no duty of care to be seen anywhere. Just shouldn't have bloody well happened.
"Just because you are a Character, Doesn't mean you have Character."
Mr Wolf
dumper
Posts: 1026
Date Joined: 03/04/08
This will be an interesting
This will be an interesting one. Last bucks party rotto cruise we had, the charter company made it compulsory that one of us needed a temporary liquor licence for the day so if someone got too shitfaced and had an accident , the charter company or skipper couldn't be held responsible.
Auslobster
Posts: 1901
Date Joined: 03/05/08
Huge question here....
...how do thirty people, plus the crew of the boat, miss someone apparently falling overboard?
sea-kem
Posts: 14857
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Condolences to the family
Condolences to the family involved, a worst nightmare for such relatively young people. I would say all involved crew and clients are probably devastated by this. Someone will have to be held accountable at the end of the day and a big shake up in the industry as a result. To be honest I'm surprised something hasn't happened of this nature before now.Sadly It always takes something as bad as this to bring about changes in procedure.
Love the West!
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
What a tragety
Condolences to his family and friends.
If you are the skipper of the vessel the buck stops with you.
It is totally your responsibility for the safety and welfare of all those traveling on the vessel you are the master of, no ifs, no buts.
That's the way it is, the way it has always been, and the way it shall be, IMO.
I really hope that a coronial enquiry gets to the truth of what happened and procedures are put in place to make sure that tragedies like this happening again are greatly reduced.
randall df223
Posts: 6454
Date Joined: 08/08/11
I don't disagree and this is
I don't disagree and this is a tragic event. However, if alcohol is a factor (and I'm not sure that is is), then some responsibility must fall upon the person consuming the alcohol. As a society we must start to take responsibility for our own actions and stop blaming others.
Every morning I look in the mirror, I see the person responsible for my future....
Fish! HARD!
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
agree Randell and MegI guess
agree Randell and Meg
I guess by operating those sort of charters which may become (or are intended as) a pissup then you need to have a strong plan in place to stay on top of this.
But imagine if upon closing time at the pub/nighty, the bouncers had to check off the names of everyone who had entered sober?
It'd be like trying to herd cats, people skylarking, giving the wrong name for a laugh, jumping in a taxi and scooting off, agro at the inconvenience.
Do you tell them they are only allowed 3 mid strengths? Chicken wire all around the deck-maybe thats the answer except if the boat sinks?
I really do feel for everyone involved, and wish that everyone reserve judgement until the full story comes out rather than immediately condemning any people etc automatically.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
crasny1
Posts: 6986
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Makes you wonder about the
Makes you wonder about the other 29 "mates" not missing him and alerting the skipper????
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
DUNGA
Posts: 86
Date Joined: 03/06/14
Good mates
pretty f**$ed for the family
There's a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot.
22Tango
Posts: 74
Date Joined: 17/11/13
Simply Tragic
Sincere condolences to the family.
I can see inflatable life jackets becoming compulsory to wear on offshore charters.
My profile picture was taken by my 3 year old son on my iPhone!!
randall df223
Posts: 6454
Date Joined: 08/08/11
An alternative solution is
An alternative solution is the 'tag' system whereby everyone on board carries a device on them that is connected by wifi to a central receiver on board. The connection is set to a certain distance. If that connection is broken, an alarm sounds on board.
Fish! HARD!
terboz123
Posts: 1358
Date Joined: 13/04/11
Randall, bang on. When i did
Randall, bang on. When i did my 3 weeks down in Antarctica we all had a boarding card, which was scanned everytime we got off and on the boat....
these processes will probaly be have to be brought in.
a hard days fishing still beats work
PGFC member
GCGFC memberRob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
that is a great idea, but
that is a great idea, but only works with people who want to cooperate-dealing with people who are a bit pissed is different.
Taking a bucks party out on a boat would be just a nightmare I reckon.
A couple of years back didnt a guy jump off one and swim ashore in the Swan for a lark?
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
mungus
Posts: 60
Date Joined: 15/03/11
Absolute tragedy for the
Absolute tragedy for the family.
However I would hate to see Nanny state mentality expanded further into the Charter boat business just because someone fell or jumped off a boat when he was pissed. (Not that I know whether or not this was the case here).
As has been already stated, someone is going to be the scapegoat, and it will probably be the skipper. I just hate the thought that in the future similar charters won't be able to happen.
I can't get my head around how the host of the charter, and his colleagues didn't notice someone missing.
The_Wanderer
Posts: 735
Date Joined: 24/09/08
WIll be intrested to see how
WIll be intrested to see how this pans out.... condolences to all involve
Rozza87
Posts: 72
Date Joined: 12/03/13
My thoughts are with not
My thoughts are with not only the family, but the crew.
Whether negligent or not, it would take a heavy toll on the skipper and decky.
Westy74
Posts: 225
Date Joined: 23/11/13
Good to see the apology to
Good to see the apology to Jazz in today's paper for implying in yesterdays report that they were part of the company as the boat operator in question.
thesupervisor
Posts: 1137
Date Joined: 10/06/09
pretty simple excess alchohol
pretty simple excess alchohol consumption and boats/water dont mix
ive been a bouncer in pubs for 22 years and still currently am
whats to say if a drunk goes into a toilet and falls in cubical chockes and dies on vomit
is it the pubs fault for not checking on his every move? no its not people need to be responsioble and accountable for their own
actions and their friends should look out for each other ,but simply dont drink to excess and very rarly will ther be problems
thats our main job in a pub is to eject people who are intoxicated as some cant decide when enough is enough
on a boat charter situation its very hard to have this control
stick to fishing in a boat much safer
getting the bottom line final answer from a bunch of blokes that use false names and put smiley faces at the end of paragraphs is not the best place in the world to get the information you seek.
Deleted
Posts: 6265
Date Joined: 26/04/14
did i hear on the news that
did i hear on the news that this charter operator has had its licence susspended?
randall df223
Posts: 6454
Date Joined: 08/08/11
Yep. I heard that too.
Yep. I heard that too. Cannot use any of its five vessels.
Fish! HARD!
Deleted
Posts: 6265
Date Joined: 26/04/14
not looking good for them
looks real bad for the operator
randall df223
Posts: 6454
Date Joined: 08/08/11
Yep. Could see some changes
Yep. Could see some changes to the operating rules, and consequently the charter costs??? I reckon the tag system is the most logical way, and easiest solution. Can you imagine trying to convince a boat load of customers they need to wear life jackets for the entire cruise.... I don't think so. But give them each a small tag on a lanyard. They wear it. They go over, alarm sounds...
Fish! HARD!
Deleted
Posts: 6265
Date Joined: 26/04/14
slightly higher rails / fall
slightly higher rails / fall guards anything above waist hieght and on enough of an angle so escape is possible, seems very simple to me. fishing charters a little more difficult
randall df223
Posts: 6454
Date Joined: 08/08/11
I think that is why the tag
I think that is why the tag system is a practical solution. A one up (reasonably low) cost to install. Then make it mandatory to wear the tag around your neck or arm- fishing charter or otherwise. Higher rails may prevent some going over the side, but still won't raise the alarm which appears (based upon the media reporting) to be the failure on this occasion. No one saw, no one raised the alarm....
Fish! HARD!
Deleted
Posts: 6265
Date Joined: 26/04/14
i no life is non negotiable
i no life is non negotiable but cost wise a simple fall rail or net would be a good start
randall df223
Posts: 6454
Date Joined: 08/08/11
www.raymarine.com/vie
www.raymarine.com/view/?id=715
Fish! HARD!
petermac
Posts: 2946
Date Joined: 03/03/10
i hope not
next passengers on a charter will need to do a take 5,have fishing plan , do a tri start before they use there rod and reel and where a safety harness
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
You've hit the nail right on the head
Bloody good suggestion for all charter operators Randeldf223 from what I read it is a very good piece of kit. Alarm sounds boat stops, if some drunk fool throws it overboard. Boat stops until it is recovered, no ifs no buts.
Punters get pissed off about it, tell them to go and see the fool who caused the trip to stop.
crasny1
Posts: 6986
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Sounds like a plan the
Sounds like a plan the tags.
But how do you ensure drunken prats dont walk off with them afterwards, as mentioned prank them overboard. I think this is so sad and as the Nanny state gets more controlling off everything in our lives. I am temted to re-read 1984 by George Orwell - as soon Big Brother will control everything we do. Just to remember what he had predicted all those years back.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
randall df223
Posts: 6454
Date Joined: 08/08/11
I suppose the ultimate
I suppose the ultimate control will be reflected in the cost of a charter. A deposit has to be paid for the tag on arrival. And collected at the end, which also forces a head count. If someone throws it overboard the alarm sounds and a head count will identify the correct number on board. Someone loses their deposit. At the end of the day if someone walks off the alarm will sound and if the tag isn't recovered, someone loses their deposit. Ultimately the passengers will pay more. But what price safety. Qantas has a great safety record and because of that people are inclined to pay more.
Fish! HARD!