Filleting lessons
So I'm a pro filleter and I've been thinking about making a little extra money on my day off by teaching people how to fillet. Just wanted to float the idea with the brains trust here to see if its worth setting up, get an idea if you guys think its worthwhile or a waste of time.
- class size max 5 people (probs more like 2 or 3 depending on the season/bookings etc), classes on Saturday mornings.
- I'd set you up with a box of fresh fish and a brand new knife and over, say, 2 hours teach you how to fillet (two styles), skin and debone fish. It would be a real hands-on, learn as you go class. All safety gear, aprons supplied too gotta stay clean and in one piece lol.
- You take home the knife and the fish you cut. Quantity of fish will obviously depend on how well you apply yourself! Species of fish will depend somewhat on seasonality and market availability, but I have a 'wish list' of species I know from experience to be best for starter filleters.
- You get me. I've been doing this for quite a few years now, so you'll have the full attention of a helpful pro for a couple of hours. We'll be able to go over technique, really get your hand in and with a bit of coaching to smooth out any bits you have problems with. I train new guys at work, teaching you lot will be pretty similar.
- Class will be suitable for rec fishos, foodies, home masterchefs etc. Beginners who haven't put knife to fish before, and intermediates who can muddle through but would like someone to hold their hand for a day to clean up their technique.
- Class held in a professional seafood environment. NOR location, close to public transport etc. (I won't say where just yet, have to clear it before I go ahead. Don't want to step on any toes till I have my ducks in a row)
- not too sure how much it will cost yet, would love to hear your opinions on what you'd consider reasonable/affordable. So far for cost of materials + a bit on top to make it worth my time I'm looking at around $100 per person. There's wiggle room though, so your input would be valuable in terms of wether you would like it cheaper or if you wouldn't mind paying a bit more in return for a more premium brand of knife or fish to practice on etc.
Opinions? If you think its rubbish, or if you know of someone out there doing this already let me know (prefer the honesty than wasting my time!). Otherwise let me know if you think its a goer, or if there's any features you would like included or changed.
[Admin- hope this is ok? I'm not advertising a business - I don't even HAVE a business yet- just gathering some opinions is all :) ]
Curndog
Posts: 441
Date Joined: 21/11/16
Good idea
hey mate I think that sounds like a great idea. I been filleting fish since I was 12 (18 years or so) and I take mates on my boat who don't know how to fillet. They would love to learn but no way il let them try out on a dhuie haha. Plus I think it's to hard trying to teach them so I just do it myself. I wish they could learn from a pro. I think $100 sounds very reasonable if they're going home with something. Surely there's plenty of people out there who want to learn. I guess only problem is people just utube everything these days.
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Thanks for the encouraging
Thanks for the encouraging feedback :)
Yes, its been my observation that perhaps the biggest reason rec fishermen cant quite get the hang of filleting is because they can't catch a big enough bag to really practice and go to town on. You need to be able to make a few mistakes when you're learning, which is hard when you've only got your mates prize trophy to have a go on!
Wannafish
Posts: 158
Date Joined: 20/05/12
Great idea!The $$ sound
Great idea!
The $$ sound reasonable, and if you could include removing the wings without tearing them out, or the need of scissors or tinsnips (as I have seen recently), skinning without leaving most of the meat on the skin, and pin-boning to end up with a bone-free fillet - I think it would be a great money earner!!
Perhaps even look at a the possibility on spending a few minutes on shelling crabs, prawns, crays, marron etc???
Flathead / flounder etc could also be included, or as an optional inclusion???? Just ideas!
knife sharpening? Types of filleting knives? Sharpeners? Packing / freezing fish??
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Thanks for the enthusiastic
Thanks for the enthusiastic feedback :)
haha removing wings is a two second job once you know how- I'll make sure its on the list of class topics, no tinsnips required.
I had thought of expanding to other seafood handling topics in future. Maybe a "crustacean round up" class talking about how to deal with a few of them more in depth. That's for the future though.
Flathead/flounder will be discussed in the filleting class. Correct selection and care of tools is the first step to good filleting so knives/sharpening will be talked about, and I don't want to see you waste fish so I'll be sending you home with a few ideas for storing your fillets.
timmy k (not verified)
Posts: 23
Date Joined: 01/01/70
i think it's a good idea
considering the price includes a knife and some fish.
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
It certainly something thats
It certainly something thats sorely needed, shits me to tears seeing guys at the Coral Bay filletting tables butchering quality fish.
Worst when you take someone fishing whose an "experienced fisho" and they fuck it up!
But if your supplying fish for them to fillet and take home plus giving a knife I dont see how you'd do it for $100 by the time you supply fish unless its 2 charlie courts and a blowie!
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Well they won't be top of the
Well they won't be top of the range trophy fish for starters! But anyone would be happy to eat the stuff on my 'wish list', I can promise they're not duds lol.
The price isn't set in stone, just a bit of back-of-the-envelope maths based on a few factors. I'm keeping in mind the recent economic downturn too, I don't want to go too high and price myself out of the running. Out of curiosity at what price do you think it would be too expensive- $120? $150? $200+? It would help to get an idea from a few folks on their opinion of the upper limit this sort of thing is worth.
Thanks for feedback :)
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
I sort of think that paying
I sort of think that paying for fish to fillet will price your cut out of it.
Have the option for people to bring their own "neighbour fish" like salmon, sambo etc as you'll get more from charging $100 to teach them than $200 for everything and supplying a $50 knife and $70 worth of whole fish.
And $70 doesnt buy much whole fish!
Otherwise, the other way is buy a couple of boxes of cray bait to practice on-blue mackeral, kawhai etc
Can still be used as cray bait...
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Well I'm in the industry so I
Well I'm in the industry so I can source stuff cheaper than retail price, and there's quite a bit more variety at market than the public usually sees- some of those underutilised species go a fair bit cheaper because of low popularity (and its the public's loss because they're perfectly decent eating for the most part). Fear not, you'll get plenty to practice on for your dollar.
I see what you're saying about keeping costs down, relying on students to supply their own fish is trouble though (plus has massive chance to be incredibly unhygienic, some people are grotty buggers lol). Supplying recreationally caught fish for commercial education purposes is not a grey area I wish to test.
Curndog
Posts: 441
Date Joined: 21/11/16
150+
I think $150+ would be too high imo. Obviously you need to supply the fish to fillet therefor customers can take it home. If you needed to increase profits/make it worth it I would drop the take home knife. I reckon Wannafish made some good suggestions too
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Its just as valuable to know
Its just as valuable to know what people DONT want and what their budgets will stretch to so thank you for that! Theres a big price difference in knives so I had thought those with cash to splash could chose to upgrade their "class package" (sounds fancy lol) and switch their knife to a more primo brand. We'll see how it goes.
I'm not overly concerned with my cut. So far the estimations keep my head above water and the rest is gravy. There's room to evolve in future once its humming along.
Anyone else with opinions and expectations on pricing feel free to fire away.
petermac
Posts: 2946
Date Joined: 03/03/10
your so right
a pommy bloke i used to dive with that lived in darwin and used to come down from darwin once a year for a diving trip to onslow (he was a butcher by trade)
Chris would get the shits with me when we were filleting the fish and , shout" stop i will do the fish the fish ' it was good i could have a beer then and watch him knock over all the fish quick time its good watching some one thats good at filliting fish quick
sea-kem
Posts: 14857
Date Joined: 30/11/09
As Rob says some of the guys
As Rob says some of the guys I've seen balls up good fish because they won't take advice on board on how to fillet. A great idea and a niche market if you can get it off the ground. I was lucky in my younger years taught by my old mate who was and ex pro no nonense fella who would scowl if you brought fresh water anywhere near fresh fillets. It's all that basic stuff that needs to be shown as well. I reckon go for it!
Love the West!
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Thank you for the
Thank you for the encouragement :)
Daniel 82
Posts: 51
Date Joined: 20/01/14
Im in great idea $100 sounds
Im in great idea $100 sounds fair what locations?
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Securing my chosen venue is
Securing my chosen venue is still in the works- I wanted to get a feel for fishos opinions on my plan before I go getting other interests wound up. As the venue is still in progress I won't be mentioning them by name just yet- but I can say it is NOR (not too far north tho, you wont have to trek to Yanchep or anything lol).
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8050
Date Joined: 07/05/12
There's already a couple of
There's already a couple of young fellas in WA who run a website on this www.filletfish.com.au but hands on is gold.
My pop taught me to butterfly fillet whiting, herring etc but it took me about 4 demersals before I got the hang of the bigger fish.
I reckon you could have a niche market idea but $100 isn't going to make it viable including fish and a knife. Have a bunch of demo knives that they can use and then they can buy the same model off you afterwards.
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Thanks for the tip about that
Thanks for the tip about that website, never heard of it before but it looks pretty smooth.
tbh, I was angling to save myself a bit of time and work with the take home knives. Crack a fresh one every class and take it with you so I don't have to spend my time on knife upkeep. Being in the industry I get knives cheaper than retail but the maths is still in progress so we'll see how it goes. I would have a some sundry accessories for students to purchase after class anyway too, knives, sharpening stones and steels etc.
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8050
Date Joined: 07/05/12
I'd pay for a lesson on using
I'd pay for a lesson on using my stone and steel for sure
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Moist and Salty
Posts: 102
Date Joined: 28/10/14
Great idea mate, I'd sign up
Great idea mate, I'd sign up for sure.
Keeping in mind that most fishos have their own knife I think the cost would be better used on more fish or more time. I think $100 sounds very fair without including a knife (which may or may not be unnecessary).
You could include a list of available/recommended knives and supply to those that need/want it?
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Thanks for your input. I had
Thanks for your input. I had planned to have a few sundry knives, steels/stones etc for purchase after class for those who'd like to take home a bit of extra kit.
Dale
Posts: 7930
Date Joined: 13/09/05
Might need to watch out that you are earning an income for this, you might need to be a trainer and assessor. Maybe not, but it's something I thought about.
"Just because you are a Character, Doesn't mean you have Character."
Mr Wolf
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Thanks for the tip, ill look
Thanks for the tip, ill look into it!
Quobbarockhopper
Posts: 391
Date Joined: 28/05/10
Nope, only need to have a TAE
Nope, only need to have a TAE qualification etc if you are delivering Nationally Recognised Training or on behalf of an organisation that requires it themselves
anyone can teach anyone anything thats not "official" really... doesnt matter that there is $ involved
Uluabuster
Posts: 722
Date Joined: 12/12/10
I am happy to join for $100
I am happy to join for $100 with fillets & knifes thrown in. Reckon that's reasonable.
jighead
Posts: 718
Date Joined: 03/02/12
Great idea
I'd go for sure.
Tradewind
Posts: 756
Date Joined: 18/09/12
Great idea, my technique
Great idea, my technique needs a lot of polishing and avoiding more bones in the fillets would make the Wife happier
Boyce
Posts: 230
Date Joined: 04/02/17
great ideawould definitely
great idea
would definitely be interested and price seems reasonable
beau
Posts: 4104
Date Joined: 24/01/10
I'd be keen as i suck, after
I'd be keen as i suck, after years and years of primarily catch and release or giving fish away and now deciding to keep a few for myslef Ive come to realise how bad I am at it. What kind of fish would you be looking at supplying? Local species? I knocked off some great fillets off kingfish recently but still struggle with large snapper so for me filleting fish we regularly catch around here like snapper would be a selling point fo rme
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Would certainly be supplying
Would certainly be supplying fresh Aussie fish. Species will depend on market availability, its primarily going to be WA fish but there might be a bit of Darwin or SA stock depending on time of year and what's around.
Marineboy
Posts: 839
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Great idea
great idea and I think the only way you will know if it's going to work is to do it, the hardest thing in small business is to get your name out there at a reasonable cost. From experience out of every 10 people that say they will use your service when you put it out there in a forum or similar only 2 will.
Good luck.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
haha thanks for keeping it
haha thanks for keeping it real mate :) I have been chewing over wether to start small, and risk going unnoticed, or going large, and risk blowing it all overnight. Just gotta pick a road and follow it I guess.
fab
Posts: 90
Date Joined: 25/05/08
Don't know how you can go
Don't know how you can go wrong with a knife, a couple of fillets and pro knowledge for $100... Great idea mate!! If you decide to do it, keep us posted... Count me in! Good luck
He who fails to prepare, prepares to fail.
ChrisG
Posts: 558
Date Joined: 30/12/11
I'm ini don't think I'm too
I'm in
i don't think I'm too bad normally....until I'm standing next to someone who is actually good at it!
bigmick
Posts: 77
Date Joined: 04/02/13
You'd seriously want to
You'd seriously want to consider being insured, because if you're offering to instruct someone for a fee and something goes wrong (which can happen quite easily when sharp knives are involved). You could be up for big biccies in medical expenses, loss of income and punitive damages if it does.
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
whoops now the lessons are
whoops now the lessons are $400, you only get a plastic knife and he's not allowed to give you the fish to take home because it might have a bone in it.
And you have to wear a full body chain mail suit
Note, Im not having a go as you are right.
But this fucking stupid US style system here...
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Yeah insurance is deffo on my
Yeah insurance is deffo on my shopping list!
timmy k (not verified)
Posts: 23
Date Joined: 01/01/70
you could just get everyone to sign a disclaimer at the start
saying anyone who cuts themselves or cuts off any fingers is held responsible for their own actions
bigmick
Posts: 77
Date Joined: 04/02/13
The only problem is that a
The only problem is that a disclaimer like that isn't worth the paper it's printed on. It's just like the "no responsibilty taken" on the signs at carparks, it's only there in the hope that it will discourage people from taking legal action.
eziliving
Posts: 865
Date Joined: 30/12/09
I'd be keen to learn the
I'd be keen to learn the quick way for the likes of garfish, hering and whiting. I dont catch many big fish anymore and you are only allowed 2 demersals in the metro area, so I dont mind taking my time cleaning them. The bread and butter fish give me the shits and I generally just give them away or use them for bait but I love eating the fillets when i can be bothered. I reckon you either bring your own knife to the session or you supply a knife for the day only and the participants give them back to you at the end of the day and not worrying about giving away a knife. I know I would prefer you to buy more fish so I could practice my filleting and buy my own knife at a later date as I would then be able to buy what I need for the type of fish I intend to catch.
Even if you supply everything how many dhuies/snappers/baldies are you going to be able to purchsae if everyone who attends gives you a $100 for the lesson. Even if you supply one decent demersal per a customer this would mean the customer would only get a two go's at reasonable size fish. Maybe you could speak with Mick C from Shore Catch on the site and work out something as i am sure he would like the scraps for his shredder, he has a venue with food processing ability's and maybe good buying power through the wholesalers. just a thought.
Get busy living, or get busy dying!
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Thanks for that, some good
Thanks for that, some good info there for me. Im starting to see a pattern that you guys might like more fish and less knife, good to know.
I have actually devised a lesson that is not species-specific and it will broadly stand you in good stead for whatever fish you drag out of the lucky dip ocean. You wont be practicing on premium species like snapper and baldies lol. They're not great for under-experienced filleters anyway. The sea is full of fish- you'll be having a go on some easier midrange stuff (still very tasty!) and gain skills that will be entirely applicable to those primo species when you catch one. I can assure you there will be more than one or two fish per student, you wont be wanting.
davewillo
Posts: 2258
Date Joined: 08/09/16
Just saw this and would be
Just saw this and would be keen for sure! I just want to learn to be a bit faster with less wastage. I guess that means getting better overall!
With a knife sounds too cheap at $100. Happy to pay that and get a good deal on a quality knife instead.
PGFC member and lure tragic
Dark Tail
Posts: 24
Date Joined: 05/06/16
Big thank you to everyone who
Big thank you to everyone who has commented so far! Your input and ideas have been invaluable. It will take me a little while to get this off the ground, so feel free to resurrect this post at any time with your thoughts- I am always open.
TF in DZ
Posts: 48
Date Joined: 06/01/17
Good Idea
And at that price fits in the gift card category. Best of luck with it mate.
rodfishsa
Posts: 82
Date Joined: 29/03/13
G'day I was thinking the
G'day
I was thinking the same as moist and salty ie drop the free knife or maybe factor it in depending on numbers.
So attendees get lessons, some fish, a bit of social contact and if you include a little info about knives and sharpening, with your contacts I would think you could offer knives and sharpeners for those interested cheaper than retail and make little profit. Maybe the option of people bringing their own knives for you to sharpen for a small fee after the class. Sounds like upselling I guess but these things could work for both parties, expert info and some well priced quality gear for those who want it.
Maybe hand protection, I've got one of those stainless mesh cloves for spiky stuff, not sure what people think of that but wished I was wearing it a few days ago cutting the ribs out of a whiting and did a big nick on my left index finger. It happens to the best of us, and me LOL
Cheers and good luck
Rod
Super peg
Posts: 760
Date Joined: 02/09/12
yeah mate, I would pay $100
yeah mate, I would pay $100 to refine my filleting, and to learn to properly sharpen the knife as well,
I think you would need to have two different classes though,
beginner and maybe and intermediate.
The art of fishing consists of casting, winding, trolling and jigging
while freezing, sweating, swatting and swearing.