Demersal Ban details

Howdy,

Please dont take this post the wrong way, I defintely want to stay within the rules of the demersal ban and look after the protected fish but can I target KG or sambos on paternoster rigs with big sinkers? 

Ive just bought my first half decent tub and my brothers and myself want to catch a big fish, weathers looking good friday. If jigs and plastics dont work, I want to have the bait option up my sleeve if we are fishless. Will I be breaking the d ban rules in anyway fishing with mulie or squid strips on the bottom?

is there a maximum hook size or anything?

 

Thanks.

Ive read a few fisheries pages and cant seem to find anything.

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scotto's picture

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age old debate jim.

Wed, 2014-10-15 06:05

I dont think youll get in trouble for that at all, but there is a good chance you'll get a demersal bycatch.

 

Just put effort into bringing your fish up slowly, so it can be released well if required. 

tim-o's picture

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Small circle hooks

Wed, 2014-10-15 06:30

Something like a 1/0 KL is great for KGs and sandies. Circles almost eliminate throat hook ups so redused risk of bleeding and fast to dehook

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I am, as I've said, merely competent. But in an age of incompetence, that makes me extraordinary.

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Just remember it is an

Wed, 2014-10-15 13:01

Just remember it is an offence to "fish for demersals" during this off season.

a large bottom rig of paternosta + big sinker + big hooks would in the view of most fisheries officers be targeting demersals, and result in an infringement. You could then argue it in court.

Lighten up you rig and target some KGs or jig for some sambos.

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Date Joined: 05/05/06

Cheers fellas, good advice.

Wed, 2014-10-15 13:40

Cheers fellas, good advice.

Starbug, i hear what you are saying with the rig and yes it would depend on the mood of the fisheries officers and myself but all Ive read on fisheries pages is 'taking or landing(what does that mean exactly?) demersals is breaking the rules. Nothing about releasing unwanted demersals caught while fishing for non protected species which would be treated as scotto advises. Jigging for sambos was on the agenda and if that fails i want to drop a bait down to them.  Then target the kgs with a lighter paternoster in 35-40m. Demersal Bycatch is possible for sure.

I dont want to end up in court over a fish and ringing fisheries will be pointless.  If I do ring fisheries id have to record the conversation and then play it back to the officer on the water who is disagreeing with what someone in the fisheries office said.

Weathers changed now anyway.

cheers fellas

 

 

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Bend over

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ok from the regs...... not

Wed, 2014-10-15 15:54

ok from the regs...... not the glossy pamphlet

http://www.slp.wa.gov.au/legislation/statutes.nsf/main_mrtitle_1458_homepage.html

Section 45

(2) During the closed season a person must not —
(a) fish for demersal scalefish in the West Coast Region; or
(b) be in possession of demersal scalefish on a boat in the
waters of the West Coast Region; or...........

so if you are fishing with a rig that is generaly used to target demersals then there is a fair chance you will be fined.

you could argue the case with a KG rig and catching a demersal on it is by catch, but using a big heavy rig I think you would be pressing your luck.

Auslobster's picture

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"Landing"...

Thu, 2014-10-16 04:07

...is the key word. If they're saying that landing demersals is prohibited, then that means catch-and-release could get you into hot water...of course, you could remove the hook or cut the line without pulling the fish into the boat and argue that you never actually "landed" it.

 

I personally would go with what the others have said and use smaller hooks/ligher gear. Off Mandurah, for example, you can get kg's and flathead in plus 50cm sizes, fishing no deeper than 20 meters, so 20 lb gear or less is ideal. Fisheries certainly couldn't pull you up on that.

 

 

tim-o's picture

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Well

Thu, 2014-10-16 06:22

I see landing as being the point when something is taken on to land, but I have had fish land on the deck of my boat, so Im confused hah. At the end of the day the ban has several benefits for the fish stocks. Everyone should do what they can to eliminate hooking demersals in this time. Hoppin placcys or baits over reef for KGs is only increasing the chance of hookin a demersal, common sense should prevail. Plenty of other species to target and techniques to improve at without risking impact on demersals.

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I am, as I've said, merely competent. But in an age of incompetence, that makes me extraordinary.

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Date Joined: 27/08/09

OK in the context of this

Thu, 2014-10-16 08:57

OK in the context of this regulation, "taking" is catching and not releasing it immediately.

"Landing" is bring a fish back to land. It is possible at the edges of the west coast zone, to head out of the zone and catch a demersal, but you are not allowed to bring that fish back into the zone and "land" it.

It just to close a potential loop hole and make the regs easier to administer.

hezzy's picture

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totally agree tim-o downsize

Thu, 2014-10-16 07:33

totally agree tim-o
downsize your gear jim , if your chasing skippy or kg,s

it is the intent of the ban to reduce fishing pressure on demersals , its everyones responsibility to do there bit while its on ,
the changes that where made to fisheries management on demersals since 2008 have been proven effective ,especially in the metro so they should be supported be rec fishers

plenty of other species to target over the 8 weeks imo

hezzy

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evil flourishes when good men do nothing

 

crasny1's picture

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Yip

Thu, 2014-10-16 09:05

Pelagics and Crays!!

And also landing demersal from shore is also "illegal". Fishing for Tailor with a mulie and "landing" a snapper for example. Has happened to me but was defore the closure so certainly possible.

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I believe the term "landing"

Thu, 2014-10-16 10:25

I believe the term "landing" in this case applies to boats bringing fish back to land. If you were to catch a demersal while you were land based fishing, and you promptly returned the fish you would comply with the regs.

Bodie's picture

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To put it simply, Jig for

Thu, 2014-10-16 11:20

To put it simply, Jig for Sambo's and downsize your rigs for KG's.

its an 8 week closure, so I think holding off on dropping down large baited rigs isn't all that hard. Plus it gives you more opportunities to 1. find more ground with sambo's and 2. work on your jigging technique!

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Cheers fellas, I know its a

Thu, 2014-10-16 13:35

Cheers fellas, I know its a grey area, and I think the measures fisheries have taken are working. Still lots of loopholes which could be closed with some work which would allow me to fish guilt free and I would welcome fisheries to inspect my boat/rig/catch etc

Jiggin sambos was the first option then if that failed i wanted to drop a bait down to them,  then target kg in 35m in a known kg area. Regarding the rig, where in the rules does it say what pound line you need to use and hook size etc? How heavy is too heavy in fisheries eyes? could an officer deem a 60lb rig with 2/0 hooks as breaking the law then its up to me to defend in court?

Plenty of other species to fish for in the ban and KG and sambos are two of them. Jigging picks up demersals as bycatch so no jigging?

Appreciate the input but im getting dizzy now!

 

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Bend over

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I honestly think that as long

Thu, 2014-10-16 16:20

I honestly think that as long as you aren't keeping demersals, you won't have any issues. 

There's no differnce between accidently catching a dhuie as bychatch during the ban, and accidently catching an undersize fish anytime during the year. As long as you do not keep the fish you're not doing anything wrong. 

Fishing for sambos/kgw etc in areas/with gear that is likely to catch signficant amounds of demersals is probably not the best idea though, as you'll be placing these fish under stress, with a potential for post release mortality. If you're targetting known kgw spots, with gear that is typically used to catch kgw, then you're doing the right thing.

seaswirl's picture

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Let common sense prevail

Thu, 2014-10-16 16:03

 I'm gonna have a chat with fisheries because I want to have a go at deep dropping for sword fish during the day. If anyone is interested have a look at what the Booby trap fishing team is doing in Texas. Last year one of the PGFC members was successful. 

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Fillet & Release

Thu, 2014-10-16 21:21

.

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Cheers again Starbug for

Fri, 2014-10-17 00:47

Cheers again Starbug for clearing the landing/taking bit up, good info.  Daniel Y your post makes sense and thats what i think im doing.

Seaswirl, it should be fisheries responsibilty to make it as black and white as possible. Then its the actual law and nothing to do with common sense.

 

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sarcasm0's picture

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Also - not all KGW are caught on reef

Fri, 2014-10-17 05:27

 Almost all of mine are caught on a small longshank hook, fresh squid tentacle on the edge of weed/sand patches and again almost all have been caught in less than 7 mts of water.  Dont get me wrong I have caught them offshore while bottom bouncing and got some beauties, but if I was avoiding bycatch and 'targetting' KGW my personal techniques would have me pretty unlikely to get a demersal.  But hey it happened to Goodz right? http://fishwrecked.com/image/why-couldnt-it-be-after-ban

Bryan

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 In the rules it says on

Fri, 2014-10-17 20:29

 In the rules it says on pg41, if you catch a demersal finfish from a boat or shore in the area during the closed season you must return it to the water as soon as possible